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194X Deluxe Edition - Anyone Interested ?page  1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 
Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
(Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
29 Jul 2009 16:03


I assume most people know the 194X shoot-em-up demo done by my. :-)

My two bigger children come now in the age in which they like plane models. They both were playing together 194x for an hour today. :-)

This brought me to idea to recreate a Deluxe (and complete) 194X version for the Natami.

Is anyone interested in helping me?

I would like to recreate the GFX for the game in higher resolution. E.g 640x480
My current idea is to pre-render the sprites with a 3D tool - with some cartoonish style filter - so that the game looks a bit nice and friendly or comic stylish.

Is there a talented 3D artist interested in helping out and rendering the required sprites for a few different airplanes, ships, and tanks?

Cheers
Gunnar


George Mystiloglou

Posts 295
29 Jul 2009 16:35


Me :-P

Wawa Tk
Germany

Posts 351
29 Jul 2009 19:22


actually one would expect this to be an oportunity to showcase the 3d core but maybe its too much for the beginning.

Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
(Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
29 Jul 2009 19:30


wawa tk wrote:

actually one would expect this to be an oportunity to showcase the 3d core but maybe its too much for the beginning.

I think this type of game is better to show the 2D features.

To show the 3D core a real 3D game makes much more sense.
For example our Star Wars space game....

Przemek Tkaczyk
Poland

Posts 24
29 Jul 2009 19:38


I'm totally interested!

I'm guessing you will also need the sound, am I right?

As a composer and sound designer I would like to contribute to this project by providing audio-side. Tell me what you think. I can send you samples of my work =)

Cheers

Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
(Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
30 Jul 2009 00:00


Przemek Tkaczyk wrote:

  I'm totally interested!
 

 
Hi Przemek,
 
Many thanks for your offer this sounds real nice.
You help is of course highly appreciated.
 
Did you play the old 194x game, already?
 
You can find downloads for many platforms here:
EXTERNAL LINK  I'm sure someone with more talent than me can improve the sound effects. :-)
 
The original game demo was designed as example on how to create such a game. In the game folder is a DATA folder which includes all the used images in BMP format and the used AUDIO files too.
 
 
Maybe you can have a look and tell me what you think?
 
Cheers

George Mystiloglou

Posts 295
30 Jul 2009 09:37


So, you don't need me for the 3D. Ok.

Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
(Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
30 Jul 2009 09:41


George Mystiloglou wrote:

  So, you don't need me for the 3D. Ok.
 

Oh no this was not meant this way.
I think I misread your post - I thought you said you are interested in getting the game.
 
I really need someone for 3D work.
If you could help out in this this would be real great! :-)
 
Would you like to rendered the sprites for the airplanes?
 
Cheers

Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
(Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
30 Jul 2009 11:39


Maybe we could brainstorm a bit about the 194X Deluxe Edition?

My ideas for the game are:
- A real "classic" 2D shooter.
- Feel and gameplay like one of the best japanese Arcade titles.
  Lots of enemies and lots of enemies bullets should make the game look very hard.
  But the way the enemies move and the way they shoot should be designed so that the game is actually not difficult to play.
  Look awesome but be fun to play! :-)
- Multi user play.
  Two or three player simultaniously working together as team.
  E.G.: 3 Players - 2 with Joysticks and 1 on Keyboard.
- We should use prerenred graphics for high visual quality
  and  to be able to give the GFX "a classic Comic" or "classic oldschool look"
  I would like to have the GFX not look like a new 3D game but
  look like an real old school game  (but at high resolution and high quality)

Game resolution:
Either 640x512 or 640x480 OR 12080x1024
I think 640x480 would give very good quality already.
If we want to really show of with the Natami features we could go silly and go for 1280x1024 also.

Game colordepth:
I would propose 15 bit colordepth.
15bit colordepth allows us to use the 3DCore for a number of nice tricks.
The 3Dcore can create semitransparent fireballs or shadows or transparent clouds get rendered by the 3Dcore.

Game play:
1) Teamplay:
I would propose that we create 3 types of player airplanes.
I always liked games were 2 player could play together as team.
Why don't go fancy here and provide even 3 player team modes?

2) General game play.
Like the 194X demo the game is similar to the best Arcade style games.
Its also quite similar in game play to the old "Hybris" on AMIGA.

There are 4 general types of enemies.

Flyers
They come in groups of 8-24 planes in fly manoevers (loops, circles etc).
The player have to shoot them down or evade them to not crash with them.
The Flyers attack primiraly by crashing into the player.

Ground Troops
Defense Towers don't move but shoot at the player.
Their bullets are rather slow and can be evaded.
They shoot a medium amount of bullets.

Other types of ground troop will be:
Tanks: Work as defense towers but also move slowly. Tanks improve the visual
game play as the move under and through ground elements like bridges or treetops.

Boots:
Small boots move and shoot - they are smilar to tanks on water.

Big Enemies
 
Big planes:
They take several hits. They shoot big salvos of bullets.
The salvos move slow and are firing in "patterns".
Because of these pattern firing the skillful player can evade them even if the screen is nearly covered with bullets.
 
 
Big ship:
Very similar to the big airplanes.
They shoot big salvos of bullets. They salvos move slow and are firing in "patterns".
Because of these pattern firing the skillful player can evade them even if the screen is nearly covered with bullets.

End bosses
Each stage should end with an end boss.
The Endboss need to be destroyed piece by piece.
The Endboss should huge salvos.
Big Warship or Flying fortress make good End bosses.

The game upgrades

The player has a Live bar.
Hits, crashed will make the player loose some live.
When hit the player is for flickering for a short moment - during that the time player is invulnerable.
This means even if the player crashes with 10 enemies shortly after each other the player only gets hurt once.

Destroying whole enemiy flayer formations or shooting big enemies and ground troops will
create bonus elements to show up.

Collecting these bonuses does privede several upgrades.

a) Healing. Live bar gets healed.

b) increase fire power.
The player starts with 2 shoots by collecting multiply fire power upgrades the number of bullets can be increaed.
From 2 to 3,4,5,6,7, and 8.

c) Super firepower boost
Collecting this upgrade will give a short fire power boots.
The bullets will grow and get more. This upgrade will basicly double the fire power for a few seconds.
This bonus also refills the amount of bombs of the player.

e) Just Bonus Score.

Boms in addition to the normal bullets that each player shoot - it can throw a bomb.
Each player does start with a limited number of bombs.
A bomd creates a huge explosion which fills about 50% of the game screen.
Everything under the bomb get destroyed - End bosses will get badly damaged.

The game display engine

The game engine allows a "layered" game rendering.

1) This means first the game background is rendered on the screen. (Water, Isles etc)

2) On top of this ground trops are rendered. Boots, tanks etc

3) On thop of this ground building are rendered. Big houses, bridges, treetops.
This means tanks will be able to drive under treetops or go inside a hanker.
Ground elements could be animated.

4) On top of this ground fire and ground smoke is rendered.
Fire and smoke are semi tranparent.
A burning tank will create smoke, but through which you can see the ground still.
   
5) On top of the airplanes are rendered.

5) On top of these come the airexplosions, airplane smoke and clouds.
Airplane smoke and clouds are translucent which allows nice effects.

6) Bullets and halos. Bullests are seen on top of everything.
Bullest cast some light around them to make them even more visual.

Game level

I would propose that we create a small number of not too long levels.
Maybe 2 or 3 for a start.
Each level should end with a typical End-boss for this area.
Like a big Warship or a big Flying-Fortress.

After the level ends the players will land automatically
- they get some bonus score according to their shooting skills
- they are healed
- and their bombs are replaced.

Game Music, sounds
A typical Arcade game music would be nice - to create the classic feeling. :-)
Music could be 4-6 voice modplayer.

In addition to this normal game sound effects.
Gun fire, explosion, etc.

What do you think about these ideas?
Do they sound good?

Cheers

Erik Bauer
Italy

Posts 227
30 Jul 2009 11:52


You could also take some ideas from Banshee where some parts of the bacground were "unflyable" like high towers, bridge overstructures and the like...

All in all an "Old school" look which is a mix between 194X and Banshee will be very very wellcome.

Wawa Tk
Germany

Posts 351
30 Jul 2009 12:23


being an artist (painter) by profession i could maybe help with graphics now and then but i must admit im not very good and have not very much experience on pixel graphics or cgx on the whole. although i have here lightwave9 so pre rendering sprites should not be a problem. someone should take over the art direction, not that it looks like bunch of incoherent graphics in the end. anyway i thought bartek is the dedicated artist of the team?

will that game be based on sdl?

Erik Bauer
Italy

Posts 227
30 Jul 2009 12:30


Painter...

Gunnar, what about scannerized handmade paintings (a la Agony) for various screens (Intro, death, level intros...)?

Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
(Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
30 Jul 2009 12:56


wawa tk wrote:

being an artist (painter) by profession i could maybe help with graphics now and then but i must admit im not very good and have not very much experience on pixel graphics or cgx on the whole. although i have here lightwave9 so pre rendering sprites should not be a problem. someone should take over the art direction, not that it looks like bunch of incoherent graphics in the end.

Multiple people could make sense to create more sprites, and more complex backgrounds scenes without putting to much load on a single person.

But you are of course right - the GFX style should be corrdinated between people.

I would image that pre-rendering the background and sprites with a 3D tool makes most sense.

This way we can create a huge number of smooth animation frames - which would be killing of you need to do in manually with hand pixeling.

I hope that the 3D artists will find a good "filter" which will make the outcome GFX look "old school" like - and not look like a 3D movie.

wawa tk wrote:

anyway i thought bartek is the dedicated artist of the team?

Yes, Bartek is the royal Natami GFX artists.
Bartek is currently on holiday I think.
I'm not a 3D modeller but I think creating big background scenes will take some time - more hands could be nice here?

 
wawa tk wrote:

  will that game be based on sdl?

I would like to code it directly for NATAMI.

This means sound is played with an AMIGA modplayer.
GFX is blitted directly with NATAMI/AMIGA HW.

I think the game could be a good schooling example  how to create a beauty game on NATAMI.
I would have liked to open source the sources of the game afterwards for others to learn.

Cheers
 

Wawa Tk
Germany

Posts 351
30 Jul 2009 13:41


i think it would be best to wait for bartek to report back as he probably will have to be an art coordinator for the project. in the meantime i might make an axample plane sprite if time allows. but whoever does it one would have to know what dimensions and movement phases (positions) are  to be rendered.
  what concerns painted backgrounds it might be an idea although they would have to be electronically postprocessed anyway so maybe doeing them in photoshop would be easier from the start. the only thing is i hate to paint with the mouse and still havnt got this wacom cintiq tablet.

George Mystiloglou

Posts 295
30 Jul 2009 14:27


Ok, so Waka and me can take care of the 3D sprites. I can also take care of the Logo/Intro/etc animations.

Guillaume Michalakakos
France
(Natami Team Member)
Posts 146
30 Jul 2009 14:41


Gunnar von Boehn wrote:

  I would propose that we create 3 types of player airplanes.
  I always liked games were 2 player could play together as team.
  Why don't go fancy here and provide even 3 player team modes?

It would be nice if the 3 planes can have different ability (speed, firepower, firerate, resistance, etc). This can improved the gameplay IMHO, especially in "team mode".
A system with experience or gold would be nice too. Like Xenon 2 : Megablast, in the end of each level, player can upgrade the plane...

Many thanks Gunnar for all your ideas and for all your work. ;-)

Erik Bauer
Italy

Posts 227
30 Jul 2009 15:03


Last post suggests me that the team could be a Mercenary group that fights with planes for money's and/or fame's sake. Here we can also insert story bits with different pilots' behaviours.

Why not even the possibility to buy crafts/craft parts like in Desposable Hero?



Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
(Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
30 Jul 2009 20:21


wawa tk wrote:

  i think it would be best to wait for bartek to report back as he probably will have to be an art coordinator for the project.
 

 
Sounds good. :-)
 
 
 
 
wawa tk wrote:

  in the meantime i might make an axample plane sprite if time allows. but whoever does it one would have to know what dimensions and movement phases (positions) are  to be rendered.
 

 
The existing 194x game includes images, which might give a good example of useful proportions and reasonable movement phases (positions).
 
The view them please download the 194x game.
Inside the 194X game folder, there is a data folder with background and spite images.
Please mind that the original GFX were scaled for a 320x200 (NTSC) screen. For a 640x480 screen they need to be rescaled, of course.
 
Here is an example of the old Red Player Sprite.
I've rescaled it to match a 640x480 screen.
Its a bit blurry because of the simple rescaled.

The Sprite include the animation phases for left/right movement.
 
The left/right move is 8 animations each.
If we go for higher resolution and don't paint the images per hand but render them then we could increase the number of animation frames to improve quality.
Maybe 16 each?
What do you think?
 
 
Cheers

Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
(Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
30 Jul 2009 20:25


Michalakakos Guillaume wrote:

  It would be nice if the 3 planes can have different ability (speed, firepower, firerate, resistance, etc).
This can improved the gameplay IMHO, especially in "team mode".

I think this is a very nice idea. :-)

Cheers

George Mystiloglou

Posts 295
30 Jul 2009 22:40


I will render the sprites at 640x480 FullScreen 24bit, so you can downgrade them to any size you want. It is better to have a real fullscreen master than small sized sprites that make it impossible to re-write the game for higher resolutions.

By the way, what type of airplane is that? I have to design it in 3D to render it...

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