IMO one of greatest aspects of the amiga's graphics was it's super smooth 50hz scrolling.. I have a nice 19" CRT monitor that syncs to 15/31KHz - but since the Natami is set to introduce some nice new widescreen HD resolutions, (and some new games will be optimized for it), I'm undecided on which monitor to use..

What would be considered as the ideal display for the Natami? TFT/LCD? CRT? ..both?? :P

Shayne Fotheringhame wrote:

I have a nice 19" CRT monitor that syncs to 15/31KHz - but since the Natami is set to introduce some nice new widescreen HD resolutions, (and some new games will be optimized for it), I'm undecided on which monitor to use.. What would be considered as the ideal display for the Natami? TFT/LCD? CRT? ..both?? :P

To me it looks like you have the perfect monitor already (if it supports higher resolutions as well). Nothing comes close to a good CRT monitor! May I ask which brand/model number and what year it is produced?

Another function - it must be a monitor for Panasonic GH-X ^_^

I'll admit I'm really fussy when it comes to the amiga's display.. I used to run winuae on 50Hz + VSync because for me smooth scrolling is so important.. The problem with that was it produced some nasty mouse lag..

Anyway I'd LOVE to see the OS running in HD but not so sure about running older games/demos on a widescreen TFT.. even with ultra fast pixel response the scrolling won't be perfect (hehe told you I was fussy..)
Also wouldn't the amiga's native resolutions be stretched on widescreen displays?

Hmmm.. maybe I'll buy TWO natami's and enjoy the best of both worlds! 8-)

A flat monitor CAN be just as fast as a CRT, it's just that most are not.

This also looks like a decent place to look for info:  EXTERNAL LINK 

Shayne Fotheringhame wrote:

I'll admit I'm really fussy when it comes to the amiga's display.. I used to run winuae on 50Hz + VSync because for me smooth scrolling is so important.. The problem with that was it produced some nasty mouse lag..

I have a small stock of old CRT monitors, so I suppose some would call me crazy ;) I never liked the picture that was introduced by flat panel screens. Most people don't seem to care, but real perfectionists do for sure. Smooth scrolling is VERY important. Games and demos with jerky movements are a typical sign that the programmer has not done his job.

Shayne Fotheringhame wrote:

Anyway I'd LOVE to see the OS running in HD but not so sure about running older games/demos on a widescreen TFT.. even with ultra fast pixel response the scrolling won't be perfect (hehe told you I was fussy..)

He he, I don't have much faith in ultra fast pixel response TFT technology either. The problem today is that there ALWAYS seems to be some sort of picture processing, filters (you name it) built-in into televisions and monitors that try to compensate for weaknesses introduced by the technology.

You don't need a new monitor to be able to run HD resolutions. Your CRT monitor will handle them all. Widescreen modes should be no problem. You'll get those black borders at the top and bottom of the screen but I assume you can live with that? Black borders are not a big issue for me but scaling of graphics and lags are.

Shayne Fotheringhame wrote:

Also wouldn't the amiga's native resolutions be stretched on widescreen displays?

If you look at the screenshots presented by Annika you can see that the video display is being stretched to fit the entire screen. This means that so far it seems the answer to your question is yes. I don't know, but I thought most widescreen monitors had an option to set the aspect ratio to 4:3. Hopefully there will be an option in the early start-up control of the Natami to control this as well. I would be very, very surprised if Thomas has not thought of this. Having to play old Amiga games in 16:9/16:10 is not something I can live with at least and I bet I'm not the only one.

Shayne Fotheringhame wrote:

Hmmm.. maybe I'll buy TWO natami's and enjoy the best of both worlds! 8-)

If you can afford it, why not? :)

Another issue with LCD's is that they are dimmer than traditional CRT screens. Those of you who have used a laptop know how difficult it can be to see the screen outside on a sunny day. Flat panel monitors have the same difficulty. Because they are dimmer, they can easily be overwhelmed by strong lighting. If you get a flat screen monitor, you may need to rearrange your computer room or office, or else you'll find yourself in the position where you cannot see your screen very well at certain times of day. Before purchasing an LCD screen, therefore, you should consider how you will rearrange your office, so that you don't find your screen dimmed out.

The rest of the article can be found here:

EXTERNAL LINK

Despite that, CRTs always show some blur, non-perfect geometry, etc, and back in the Amiga days, I haven't found any monitor that provided an acceptable image - either blur in the corners or blur in the center, etc... These days are luckely over with LCD displays. The geometry is perfect, straight lines remain straight lines, and the image is crisp everywhere. I wouldn't want to buy a CRT anymore.

So long,
Thomas

The link you provided was a good source for finding detailed info. This only confirms my suspicions further. It's frightening to see how much stuff the producers put into these displays. If people think the world has become a better place after these screens entered the market, they have probably been thoroughly duped. LOL!:-D

Resolution:

The resolution of a TFT is an important thing to consider. All TFTs have a certain number of pixels making up their liquid crystal matrix, and so each TFT has a native resolution which matches this number. It is always advisable to run the TFT at its native resolution as this is what it is designed to run at and the image does not need to be stretched across the pixels. This helps keep the image at its most clear and at optimum sharpness. Some screens are better than others at running below the native resolution (see the interpolation section). You cannot run a TFT at a resolution of above its native resolution. Make sure your graphics card can support the desired resolution of the screen you are choosing, and based on your uses. If you are a gamer, you may want to consider whether your graphics card can support the resolutions you will want to use to power your screen.
 
Interpolation / Scaling of Resolution:
 
While TFT screens are best run at their native resolutions, it is possible to run them at lower resolutions if need be. This interpolation of the resolution, from below the native, leads to some loss in image clarity and sharpness as the image is stretched across pixels. In office use this can be a problem and can look quite poor, but in gaming, it is generally not so much of a problem. The ability of a TFT to interpolate the image depends on the particular panel used, and some manufacturers have been able to improve the ability of their panels to run outside the native resolution. Generally though it is not recommended to run outside the native resolution on a TFT if you can help it.
 
Where screens are having to handle lower resolutions, the image will normally be interpolated and stretched to fill the screen completely. This can cause particular problems with widescreen format monitors since a 4:3 resolution would look very strange stretched to fill a 16:10 screen. One way manufacturers can get round this is with the use of aspect ratio retention methods including what is commonly referred to as 1:1 pixel mapping.

A TFT provide always much blur, exept in the native resolution.
If you use only Workbench and are happy with the speed etc. in the native mode it may ok. But with Games or fullscreen Images without scaling native resolution sux. And the Picture is much more bad then a cheap CRT.
I seen many TFTs, some cant even display 640x512. One Samsung cant even display 800x600, it makes a flickering picture if you draw
a pixel Array like 1,0,1,0..

For Windows ok, 1 resolution, no games, fast graphics and scaling.
All new TFTs would have FullHD with that resolution even Natami may not fast.

And a straight line result in straight lines of diffent colors or something similar(exept native).

I agree with your comment about glare displays. I wouldn't have bought a laptop with such a screen.
 

Thomas Richter wrote:

Despite that, CRTs always show some blur, non-perfect geometry, etc, and back in the Amiga days, I haven't found any monitor that provided an acceptable image - either blur in the corners or blur in the center, etc... These days are luckely over with LCD displays. The geometry is perfect, straight lines remain straight lines, and the image is crisp everywhere. I wouldn't want to buy a CRT anymore.

I see your point, but to me those adjustments mean freedom. I have never been plagued with blur. The problems caused by flat screen panels and their "one resolution" mode + the "interpolation" stuff is a bigger concern than blur anyway. For your type of usage (office work I assume?), I don't have a problem understanding that LCD's are perfect.

For gamers and users like me (who run DOS and older software from time to time too) TFT's are not an adequate option (nor for the Natami, I think), but I suppose some people just don't care (or has a choice).

Since Christian also came with some good points, I don't need to say much more. I don't have a problem understanding that some people prefer flat panel monitors, but I do have a problem with the market deciding what's right for all customers. "Buy our flat panel monitor, accept its limitations and flaws or get an old CRT monitor from the local recycling plant".

1600SW panels are readily available, and very inexpensive on the used market. They were designed to use the OpenLDI standard (which did not reach wide-spread acceptance-hence the low ebay prices), so to use them with Non-SGI Visual Workstation systems, you will also need to pick up a SGI Multilink Adapter... so this will inflate the total cost of getting an SGI 1600SW to run on other equipment to $200.00-$300.00 USD.

It would be very interesting to see a Natami hooked up to one of these! I would suppose that it would be best as a switchable secondary display, for desktop use, and to use a Viewsonic or other high-end CRT to ensure total compatibility.

Here's some links, if anyone wants to try it out:

1600SW side image:
EXTERNAL LINK 
SGI Legacy Page:
EXTERNAL LINK 
Wikipedia:
EXTERNAL LINK 
OpenLDI Spec:
EXTERNAL LINK 
Images of the Display:
EXTERNAL LINK

heheh.. providing they are 50 euro's each!
I'm joking ;)

I'm wondering.. probably a silly question but will the VGA and DVI output simultaneously or only one output at a time.. ?