| Anyone Want to Make a Racing Game? | page 1 2 3 4
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Richard Maudsley
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 400
06 Mar 2010 21:08
| EXTERNAL LINK
That's enough for tonight. Now I think I'll go use my amiga or something.
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Louis Dias
USA
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Posts 33
06 Mar 2010 21:23
| I like Fieros...in particular the Fiero GT
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Richard Maudsley
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 400
06 Mar 2010 21:27
| Bask in the glory of the trans am.
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Thundery End
United Kingdom
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Posts 31
06 Mar 2010 21:37
| I might have to dig out a version of Lightwave that I'm legally licensed for, try to remember the keyboard shortcuts and have a go at modeling that Porsche.
Never liked the 911, but that 928 looks (and sounds) awesome.
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Thundery End
United Kingdom
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Posts 31
06 Mar 2010 21:44
| @Richard Maudsley Generally when modeling a car you end up spending 3/4 of the poly budget on the wheels just trying to make them look almost round.
Ideally they should take up less than a quarter of the budget. Basically, the trick is to make an uncapped cylinder of the right size and shape with at least 12 sides, textured with a blurred tyre tread image, then cap it on the outside with a square polygon textured with an image of a wheel. From all angles this will resemble a fully modeled tyre and wheel but use a tiny fraction of the geometry.
With multiple transparent textures you can even simulate brakes glowing red. Unless you're pausing a racing game, taking a screenshot and zooming in on the wheels you won't notice they're basically faked.
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Richard Maudsley
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 400
06 Mar 2010 22:07
| Thing is though, it's a pain in the arse getting transparent bits in the right order in zmod. And it's a very outdated techinque, last game I saw do it was from 2002.
In the polycounts i've been listing here, all four wheels are 492 of it, that's 123 each. As far as I know, multiple instances of the same object make up only a fraction of the processing power needed. That's because most of the work is already done on the first object. Atleast, according to The book on unreal tech 3 I own. So really, I could make wheels with 250 polygons each and it wouldn't make much difference. I won't though. we shall have a huge framerate instead.
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Thundery End
United Kingdom
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Posts 31
06 Mar 2010 22:22
| Richard Maudsley wrote:
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Thing is though, it's a pain in the arse getting transparent bits in the right order in zmod.
In the polycounts i've been listing here, all four wheels are 492 of it, that's 123 each. As far as I know, multiple instances of the same object make up only a fraction of the processing power needed. That's because most of the work is already done on the first object. Atleast, according to The book on unreal tech 3 I own. So really, I could make wheels with 250 polygons each and it wouldn't make much difference. I won't though. we shall have a huge framerate instead.
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Well it's easy enough to swap the wheels out when you start using a less finicky program.
The UT3 book is most likely talking about 'Instanced' objects.
I'm not sure how much saving in calculation there is when the 'instances' of a single object are facing different directions and therefore lit differently.
Certainly the lighting and rotation calculations for the front wheels are the same, and likewise the back two wheels will share the lighting calculation load. The fact that only one wheel's geometry and textures are kept in memory is a big saving though. The engine might draw all four wheels from the single instance in cache. I'd leave the wheels out of your polycount stats, just list the car body without wheels as no doubt you'll design one good low poly set of them later to share across all your cars.
Pretty much the absolute minimum for a round looking wheel will be 27 triangles. If the engine uses either tri-strips or quad rendering as Gunnar suggested, the wheels could be rendered far faster per polygon/tri compared to the irregular shaped car body. Now, off to find high-res Porsche 928 pics...
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Richard Maudsley
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 400
06 Mar 2010 22:48
| Thundery End wrote:
| | Well it's easy enough to swap the wheels out when you start using a less finicky program. |
Don't hurt Zmodeler's feelings. It's been very good to me all this time. Thundery End wrote:
| The UT3 book is most likely talking about 'Instanced' objects.
I'm not sure how much saving in calculation there is when the 'instances' of a single object are facing different directions and therefore lit differently. |
Lighting? We don't need your stinking lighting :) Well I suppose we do actually. Unless people don't mind having lights on the car that don't work. You bring up a good point. Thundery End wrote:
| I'd leave the wheels out of your polycount stats, just list the car body without wheels as no doubt you'll design one good low poly set of them later to share across all your cars.
Pretty much the absolute minimum for a round looking wheel will be 27 triangles. If the engine uses either tri-strips or quad rendering as Gunnar suggested, the wheels could be rendered far faster per polygon/tri compared to the irregular shaped car body.
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I thought I had a good set already. :( Don't you like tri-spokes?
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Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
07 Mar 2010 04:27
| Richard Maudsley wrote:
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As far as I know, multiple instances of the same object make up only a fraction of the processing power needed.
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This is new to me :) The Cost for a 3D Object is many fold.
A) Matrix Rotation. This cost is equal to the number of vertexes
B) Poly overhead. This cost is equal to the number of polies
C) Line overhead. This cost is equal to the number of screen lines that are touched.
D) Pixel render. This cost is equal to the number of actual pixels covered on screen times the texture caching factor. Multiple instances of the same object just multiply the cost.
If you render these instances right after each other then you have a good chance that your cache rate will be good.
This means the last cost will go a bit down. Cheers
Gunnar
(Written with AWEB)
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Peter K.
Germany
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 167
07 Mar 2010 10:41
| Hi Thundery,
a 928 model would be fantastic! I also like this car very
much!
Special regards to all shark-fans onboard!
Peter
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Richard Maudsley
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 400
07 Mar 2010 12:23
| Gunnar von Boehn wrote:
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This is new to me :)
The Cost for a 3D Object is many fold.
A) Matrix Rotation. This cost is equal to the number of vertexes
B) Poly overhead. This cost is equal to the number of polies
C) Line overhead. This cost is equal to the number of screen lines that are touched.
D) Pixel render. This cost is equal to the number of actual pixels covered on screen times the texture caching factor.
Multiple instances of the same object just multiply the cost.
If you render these instances right after each other then you have a good chance that your cache rate will be good.
This means the last cost will go a bit down.
Cheers
Gunnar
(Written with AWEB)
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The UT3 book is lying again... Not the fist time it's happened.
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Richard Maudsley
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 400
07 Mar 2010 23:46
| EXTERNAL LINK
People in 1979 thought this was cool. I'm inclined to agree.
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Marcel Verdaasdonk
Netherlands
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Posts 2100
08 Mar 2010 11:44
| I personally think the Mazda MX5 is cool, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
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Richard Maudsley
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 400
08 Mar 2010 20:40
| Mark II only though. The first one looks like a bar of soap and the newst model is overdone.
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Bartek K
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 1332
11 Mar 2010 19:47
| Hi Richard, Thank you for uploading sample models, they look awesome:) As you probably know we are already working on a shmup called 194x Deluxe. I am the only 3D artist working on it at the moment. Thanks God there is Michael supporting the 2D side in a beautiful way! We were wondering if you would have some spare time and like to join our Team and give us a helping hand with the game development? Regards
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Matt Hey
USA
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Posts 204
12 Mar 2010 02:03
| Richard Maudsley wrote:
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I don't need to explain this car, I don't think. but I think the '70 camaro, the '80 Camaro and Firebird are the three most beautiful cars america has ever produced. Go find a '70 or '71 camaro in red, with wire wheels and knock off hubs. Jaw dropping.
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I always thought the 1st generation Camaro with a bit of tweaking was the best looking. Chevrolet should have gone more retro on the new one even though it still looks nice. I like the looks of the 80's Camaros but most are trashed and cheap here in the U.S. They were never really muscle cars and not very many are fast.
One of the nicest bodies ever created in the U.S. was not a muscle car at all. The body was designed at a University of California by a student of Chinese descent. The car itself has a unique motor designed by a German engineer. The car is Japanese engineered and manufactured. The car in my garage is a '93 Mazda RX-7 (3rd gen) with Wankel engine and twin turbos. It's a race ready, lightweight, pure sports car that's 10/10 in fun to drive. Bolt-ons get my 7 in the 12's in the 1/4 mile but it's better known for handling and breaking. These "affordable" race ready sports cars are what is fun. Maybe have a few from every country that produced them. I think of the Mazda RX-7, Toyota Supra, Nissan 300ZX or 350Z, Honda S2000, Lotus Elise/Exige, BMW M3, Porsche 944S/T or maybe 928 (some models were close to the price range of 911), Chevy Camaro and/or Corvette, Ford Mustang Cobra? (I've never been much of a Ford fan except for GT40/GT and they are too pricey). No offense if I left anything out. It's just off the top of my head :).
Here is a link to a 3D model someone did of the 3rd gen RX-7...
EXTERNAL LINK The guy used Cinema 4D!
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Richard Maudsley
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 400
13 Mar 2010 11:23
| Bartek Kuchta wrote:
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Hi Richard,
Thank you for uploading sample models, they look awesome:) As you probably know we are already working on a shmup called 194x Deluxe. I am the only 3D artist working on it at the moment. Thanks God there is Michael supporting the 2D side in a beautiful way!
We were wondering if you would have some spare time and like to join our Team and give us a helping hand with the game development?
Regards
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Yes I would Like to join and help! Right now though, I have to finish decorating my house, so It might take a week before I can be useful.
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Gunnar von Boehn
Germany
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 3738
13 Mar 2010 16:48
| Richard Maudsley wrote:
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Yes I would Like to join and help!
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Perfect!
Welcome to the team. Please go to the "team forum" and we will continue there...
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Richard Maudsley
United Kingdom
| | (Natami Team Member)
Posts 400
13 Mar 2010 21:43
| Great! I'll go there now.
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Do you have questions about the Natami?